I made a post some time ago looking at OCD's numbers, the numbers were fetched by @hivetrending using things like the beneficiary settings and ocd's account creation tokens to validate them. TL;DR, we had roughly 15% retention rate throughout 4 years onboarding roughly 3000 accounts with 450 still being active within the last month.
Banner created using Sora.
The activity in our onboarding initiative is not great, you can kind of estimate the amount of new users being onboarded by how often the @ocdb posts get posted with 8-10 new users being highlighted in each post and the rewards going to the onboarders for having spent time and effort to onboard, guide and curate the new users. Meaning for the most part this is done by people who like doing it as the rewards aren't that great.
Something I've been wondering about is, how do we scale this properly?
The DHF could be a solution to reward active onboarders better so that they could focus more on it rather than just doing it as a hobby that may earn them a little.
Now I haven't really crunched many numbers or anything, but I figured I'd use this post to see what you guys think about it. We at OCD wouldn't mind shifting our curation focus a bit more on curating onboarded users as that's something that's taken quite some voting power from us as of late.
The idea of course would be that the more users we bring on the more decide to stay and the more stay active and continue to remain active and potentially even bring users in on their own. While the onboarders who have a task that may require quite a lot of effort to do well and time spent may earn some extra rewards transparently for bringing in new people.
We may be spending a lot of money on things like brand marketing, conferences, etc, but very few of those are giving us any legitimate numbers as to how many real users it's bringing in compared to direct onboarding. Our 3000+ onboarded users can all be tracked and validated by the community and we intend to keep it that way (although we'd love to update some of our onboarding tools to move away from hiveonboard.com to a more maintained platform).
Anyhow, this post is mostly just meant to work as a sound check to see what people think about it cause I don't think continuing to use the author rewards pool is going to scale well if we want this initiative we've honed somewhat to be as seamless as possible to grow and after a while see if it's making a real difference. If you think about it, 450 users still being active today after the 3000 we've onboarded for minimal rewards is still quite a large number if all active users we have today are around 5000 as I've heard that number flying around. It'd be interesting to see what we could do with 10-50x more onboarders being active at once and curation projects and stakeholders shifting their focus on welcoming the new users with part of their votes.
Before I say anything else, I'd like to point out that the 15% active retention rate is a pretty impressive number by most web forum standards. I say that as somebody who has been moderating, admined and even started a number of web forums/communities going back all the way to 1995. We often operated by a 20-10-5 rule, meaning that if 20% of sign ups said something once in a while, 10% said something regularly, and 5% were active enough to suggest the forum to even one of their friends we were doing a bang up job. One a more typical scale, I have a Facebook niche community with 19K followers/members and if we hear from 150-200 people a month, that's a massive win.
People throw around a lot of ideas with respect to getting more people to join Hive. As a nine year old venue, it often seems to me that we'd be better served by sharing individual corners of Hive rather than Hive as a generality. Also, let's keep in mind that nobody else thinks Hive is nearly as cool as those of us who have poured 8-9 years into this place do.
This all goes back to taking a closer look at how people use the web. You don't really hear too much about people who are just "on Facebook," or "on TikTok," or "on X/Twitter." They do or follow very specific things on those platforms, meaning that you are coincidentally on Facebook because you are part of a Facebook gardening group or gaming group, for example.
I have a feeling that pitching Hive purely as a blogging or content creation venue leaves is with a relatively small niche. Consider, for example, how Splinterlands was — at one time — the biggest driver of new accounts, but not because of Hive; because of a game. The draw was the game, not Hive.
We have not really done a great job of building strong interest based communities within the hive ecosystem, and I think that may be part of the challenge in obtaining new members.
Personally, I have primarily shared Hive as a one-on-one pitch to people I knew were bloggers are writers. Sadly, none of the people who actually made accounts are active. Their primary reasons have been (1) it's too complicated and (2) they didn't like the idea of content that was only monetized for a week. And I honestly can’t disagree with those two as objective obstacles.
Having incentives for people to be "Hive evangelists" in terms encouraging people to join the community is great, but there must also be an active system to make those signups feel like they have really "become part of something;" from contests only for newbies, to "minnow-building" initiatives, to... remember "newbie re-$t33m Day" once a week?
Your reply is upvoted by @topcomment; a manual curation service that rewards meaningful and engaging comments.
More Info - Support us! - Reports - Discord Channel
Need a really slick one-pager website that gives the following message to wannabe content creators:
It needs to be as simple as uploading a tweet, and the blockchain element needs to be invisible. No one cares how it works. People want to share and get rewarded for what they share. I've been so sick of seeing the same posts for years on HIVE about how HIVE (and back in the day) STEEM works to get people rewards.
Sure, people need to know the mechanism of it, but back up the above with some hardline numbers (about engaged consistently awesome authors and content creators) - and the fact that posting to the blockchain is immutable (ie, will be there forever) should be the real focus.
I didn't care how Steem worked when I made my first post. I'm always here because I need an outlet, and the key with true creatives is that they're going to create - whether there is a reward or not.
You mean like this:
The onboarding system at Talent Land took about 2 minutes. This was created by @starkerz
Is that something that is now always on for new people that want to join HIVE and share their content? Or was Talent Land a one off event?
It's intended to be something that anybody can use. The process is still a little bit buggy because it was developed for Talent Land in bit of a rush, but it's being cleaned up as we speak. Should be ready in no time so you can use.
You're welcome to check it out:
https://app.holahive.com/?ticket=holahive
https://talentland.distriator.com/#/uploadSelfie (Open in Keychain)
Cool! Is the Why Hive something you guys administer as well? Would be good to have the Why be more about content immutability. That is a big appeal of the platform for long term authors, I think.
We did that with our selfie app at Talent land. it even pre populates the title and the tags for you. and once you post it send you instant liquid HBD and satoshis
We have had several brainstorming sessions on this exact subject lately. This idea of trusted on boarders keeps coming up. A type of vouching system, that anyone onboarded by a vouched/trusted onboarder, then anyone they onboard gets support for the start of their hive journey. An idea of gamifying and rewarding actions, actions designed to slowly learn more and more about the blockchain. Ie. If join a community and make a post in it, you are rewarded a bit for the action, or if you go vote witnesses and show it..get rewarded. The key is these folks were onboarded by vouched onboarders.
And i think the Talent Land guys just made an account called @pioneersupporter …my understanding is that it is going to follow and reblog any post created by someone onboarded at talent land. Allowing people to just follow that account and be able to see and support any rebloged post, because they are known new users onboarded at talent land.
It feels the time to make a big push.
Several of us are getting together in June for Hive Hub Guatemala. Which will be an ongoing, in person onboarding operation.
If enough of us all start pushing in our own ways, and all support each other… i think we have a real chance to catch a bull wave, and be better prepared for retention!
Apis is another great new onboarding initiative!
Your reply is upvoted by @topcomment; a manual curation service that rewards meaningful and engaging comments.
More Info - Support us! - Reports - Discord Channel
Not ironically, but in Brazil specifically, and because it is a tropical and festive country by nature, people are only interested in flashy things. And multichain events and things like that only attract very specific niches.
What drives networks is the base, and the base is not niche. The base wants fun and if they can do that on a social network that monetizes them, even better. There are several options that I have thought about doing, but I believe that holding events with barbecue and beer sponsored by HIVE is one way.
For example, in the city where I am currently, there is a concert venue with capacity for 400 people and for 1,000 HBD you can promote an event for one night and have a party, with drinks, music and lots of people.
I have already designed several ways to hold this event, calling it Hive Party, for example, and that advance tickets could only be purchased via Proof of Participation, for example by someone posting an Introduce Yourself post and this would entitle them to a ticket, so that they would not have to pay to go to the party and we would have a new member.
The posts would be posted within an exclusive community for the party, where it would be an easier place for them to be curated and consequently to post about the party, and why not Snaps during the party.
In addition to the usual payment method, there would be a QR Code available for payment via HBD/HIVE for those who wanted to pay via KeyChain or even using the Hive Debit Card.
In short, there are several ways to hold this party and it would attract an audience that is not often invited, especially since the biggest Hive holders are not very club-goers.
And 5 HBD per new user (or less if it generates value) is a cost up to 20 times lower than other projects.
But I don't fool myself into thinking that anyone would help with this initiative, not because of the high cost (which is not based on what is spent on other initiatives that try to bring in new users), but because the interests of the sponsors are directed elsewhere.
However, I wish I was very wrong, and if you think I am wrong, just tell me, I believe it will be enough motivation for me to publish this idea on my profile.
I think if you believe that this is a good way to onboard new users and trully believe you can do this then you should at least try. We already spending 100K for a damn Race Car just to look as a legit Brand. I meen... cmmon. So I believe 1000 HBD is more then possible if you can deliver a solid plan. I meen, DHF should be possible as well and worth trying that, but you already have @starkerz and @acidyo who would like to help you out and maybe we can find more people who can help you out. I believe face to face onboarding is so far the best onboarding we have when oboarded by a trusted user on Hive who has already built own reputation on Hive. You could even start by posting related articles about the project where you would be well curated and use these funds as well. It would take some time but that's also a way to do it.
I thought about it when I was typing, but I didn't have the courage to mention it because I was embarrassed, haha
I took into consideration everything you, @stakerz and @acidyo said and I'm going to make a better post explaining the idea.
Check out @cbrsphilanthropy how we posted our updates and gained just enough rewards to pay for stuff we needed. If you need any help with your article or help with ideas, you are more then welcome to talk to us on Discord ;)
im down to support this type of thing. especially if its demonstrating use of HBD, distriator, debit cards, etc.
ideally for me, we create a platform for the event using BAC, and on the tickets everyone gets a link to a free hive account (if they bought a ticket). then they have some tasks to promote the event on their own web2 and screen shot their post, post to hive and get rewards like on @hive-echo. therefore, some of them come to the event already with hive in their wallets.
others can get hive accounts on the entry, and if everyone take a selfie with the selfie app made by @sagarkothari88 with @vempromundo then they get free HBD and satoshis directly to their wallet. then they can spend at the event and claim cash back with distriator. then after the event, they go on the follow list by @prioneersupporter and everyone can vote them when they post after the event since they will be showing up in that feed.
or something like that!
I don't see why this shouldn't be possible to be funded. These kind of initiatives are something we'd wanna fund as many of our onboarders host webinars and skype/discord calls where they let potential newcomers know about hive basics and invite them to it after. I'd be interested in knowing more about the flow of your idea, maybe even pick one of the methods and stick to it, sounds a bit similar to talenland so maybe @starkerz and co could assist with the tools used there for an easy account creation and first post and then later learning more.
We're a bit behind with liquidity on poshtoken at the moment but if we don't go the DHF way we may even be able to help fund this with poshtoken similar like we did an event in Indonesia through @macchiata.
I think we place too much emphasis on earnings when we onboard people. It sends out the wrong message and people join with the wrong mindset.
If onboarders keep using earnings as a lure to make their work easier, then at least be realistic about the potential ie you may get a few cents compared to zero on web2. Overselling is doomed to fail, as we have seen
blog post earn was always a bad approach. not everyone is a blogger. especially not me :)
I go through stretches where I blog frequently and then times when I'm doing and moving in the world. Parts of fall and winter seem well suited for blogging.
I'm well aware of this problem. I've recruited at least 20 people on Hive. Only one is still active.
People are apparently full of distractions from other media. And Hive is just a bit more complicated than the rest. 🤷♂️
lets put them on @pioneersupporter follow list and make sure they are curated
i tried get some people i know on hive but everyone was like "oh crypto is scam", "oh nah i rather just buy bitcoin and wait it to moon" and stuff like that...is not really easy to onboard...
also being an onboarder is not simple because if the onboarded does something bad, YOU get blamed and blacklisted for this because it is your responsibility what the onboarded does... which is wtf? if you onboard me and explain all about hive and then i do identity theft, why should you pay the consequences of my mistake?
it would be good to incentivize new accounts with votes, as long as they are legit users and content is good. @hivetrending for example does a monthly 500 HP delegation contest for new accounts with pizza community, thats an other good option
I've been in hive for about 5 months. I find it so fun to read comments from other hivers. I find it purposefully to explore other hivers daily activities, foods and travels. I have invited a friend here only one and I'm happy that she is now one month in hive active. I think it really needs dedication and passion to be here. Since when I was young I was a passionate writer and a publisher of school publication. I do write articles, features, entertainment and even local and international news. I'm so happy that my friend antonette who was very long staying here in hive introduced me this platform. I find this platform helpful and user friendly and I think the problem of so much onboarding yet not active depends on its passion to write and show the world its ideas, another factor also is there's a lot of blogging platform which users can use. But this platform I find it very smooth, fun and engaging!
I always get sad when I read how little active users Hive has. I tried to convince some people I know to join Hive but so far I had no success.(one classmate joined, stayed for +- a month and left without making any post, comment or buying a single Hive. This story still feels very disappointing to me)...
The truth is that those who have been on the platform for several years, have better voting power, more experience in the platform should get together and carry out a more motivating strategy because it is true that sometimes it demotivates a little, on my part to create even art when I do not have votes sometimes not always, I say this for the newcomers.
I have entered the platform about 20 people and active I think there are 4 or 5 the others do not see results and leave, because it is 70% want something to motivate them.
For my part, whatever you want, I am present to help you with my little bit. Good initiative you are creating @acidyo. Regards 🤝😉
The
Photo without users that I have entered hive
Hive and Splinterlands both need new users. Anything that can bring new users would be great. Author rewards are not entirely super low, but I guess they could be better for new users.
Hi, I don't know what the DHF is. Sorry if I don't know many things, but I'll tell you what I do know:
From my personal experience, I hope Hive stops being seen as a hobby and becomes a way to make a living. Although I know that for many of the people I know in my country, it's a way to generate most of their income, but they're people who have been on the platform for more than three years. As a relatively new user, it's been difficult for me to monetize with Hive. However, I'm here because my mom supports me, since she wants me to study. However, I would like to help her with the household expenses or, better yet, pay for my studies myself, but Hive doesn't give me enough to do that, so I think of Hive as a hobby. I wish it were like you suggested:
Writing so I could dedicate myself solely to this while studying, but it takes time, and that's the part that many young people like me find difficult.
I recently recruited a friend. However, he was enthusiastic the first few days, but unfortunately, it doesn't allow him to sustain himself, and he creates content on Hive when he has time because he sees it as a hobby that generates some income to pay for a treat. This is the reason why many drop out, since there are expenses to cover.
With this great comment, I want to endorse the fact that hopefully those of us who are active on Hive and doing it well can see better results and be taken into account. I know you have to be consistent and create quality content to achieve this, but sometimes we go unnoticed.
Thank you.
This is not a realistic approach, if you mean just creating content. The focus should be on savings.
Whoever earns the most on Hive right now, publishing generates 500 HBD per month. The Venezuelan who earns the most, gets 200 HBD per month. Maybe if you look at it as a part-time job, it could be.
However this depends on each creator, not on Hive. Hive cannot guarantee rewards, since it is not a company that hires you. It is the community that distributes the rewards.
There are other ways to earn on Hive, but you have to invest time and money.
One thing I can tell you; Hive is not for people who think in the short term. Here the real results come in the long term. Who thinks about how much he will earn monthly, will not do well; but who thinks about how much he will have earned in a year, will do much better.
Translated with DeepL.com (free version)
Retention is still a pain point in this process. Then, as a newbie, they are expected to already know so many things. It's not that easy to introduce crypto to new users. There are steps to it and unfortunately, once they are here, they are expected to know many things. I've talked to some I onboarded and some of them mentioned getting scared of posting into community because they have no idea why they are muted and when I checked, it doesn't seem like they are doing wrong either.
I believe onboarding is about the time and the place - we kinda discussed that in Graz.
Offering people anywhere "making money for blogging (vlogging, photoposting, or even just Actifit reports)" on a blockchain platform always feels somewhat scammy nowadays, especially if you reveal the earnings are paid out in crypto. People automatically assume we want them to buy something first and then promote it just like we do. Not the thing for random passers by in the streets of Graz, Prague, Vienna...
The time and place to me is any wannabe influencer conference - the atendees already create content and strive to earn a few penny for that, and likely don't succeed for not having enough audience. That's why they attend such event. These people might be open to learn a thing or two about Hive more then any other segment.
At least in Europe.
I'm just wondering what goes through the minds of those passive Hivians. 🤔 I'm sure unmet expectations play a role. I myself was inactive for a long time.
good question, scaling is essential point
Each onboarded person need to have guidance through there is different to "onboard" and "onboard and guide". Most people when create account don't even know what to post, what to write about and even if they do they getting zero interaction, zero upvotes , they don't even know what is the possibilities are here - Even if they got questions , there is most likely noone to answer. Also a lot onboarded people have a lot to offer they don't necessarily what to post, they might be interested in being part of the projects being involved....
I think retention is a bigger issue right now that getting people in the door. We seem to be losing good people who just give up or running them off for whatever reason. Nobody is going to want to join when they see that stuff happening. We need to sort that out and then I think the masses will come.
Very interesting post @acidyo, from my point of view and with the information I have, it is important to determine what are the reasons that lead to poor results in the retention of new users.
I think that the dynamics of life drives to want “fast” results, taking on new projects that require time and learning, many find it unattractive. Learning about digital wallets, cryptographic keys and block chain understanding is the real challenge for Hive to keep growing and consolidating.
Encouraging simplicity and familiarity in the use of these platforms can help the growth and permanence of users. I don't know if this is possible for the programmers.
Niche communities are the way. I have almost 8 years doing onboarding and the best results (outside of the 2017 Venezuela crisis and pandemic) I have had with @hiverun.
Although we don't have good income (less than 3%) we have a retention higher than 50%.
All communities should do onboarding and not stay with the ones in Hive. OCD incubation should focus on that. There are many communities already formed on facebook, reditt and internet forums that can be targeted.
In addition to rewards, contests and gamification should be incorporated. In @hiverun we have rewards for achievements, plus the other clubs generate passive income for their runners with beneficiaries. Imagine offering a percentage of everything your “referrals” make forever. So an origami community could bring in origami influencers to bring in their community.
At Hive Run we give badges, roles, shirts, jackets, race registration and votes.
Translated with DeepL.com (free version)
I love Hive, it's a part of me now. My family, my studies, and Hive.😍
!PIZZA
$PIZZA slices delivered:
@danzocal(3/10) tipped @acidyo
Come get MOONed!
Need to grow up hive price .. same like btc .. and one more think i wish acidyo so fast reviled his face .. love and respect from my side ❤️
I believe that's a good idea. I know OCD's Onboarding (and Orientation) Program has very good results both for onboarding and for retaining the users who join. It's worth exploring this as a scaled up method of growing our numbers and loyalty of users in this space where catching people's attention and keeping it is increasingly difficult.
Been saying this for years. 99% of the DHF does little to nothing to onboard new users. Our Hivefest is only focused on existing users. Our “marketing” (Rally cars that come in last place in third world countries, ignite marketing team, bore holes in places with no internet) does absolutely nothing to onboard users.